David Cunliffe vs Don Brash

This from Q&A...

Cunliffe kicks arse on asset sales

Written By: Eddie
”At the start of the year, John Key said that he wanted to have a mature debate on asset sales. Now, his Finance Minister and SOE Minister are refusing to front up to debate David Cunliffe on the issue. Instead, that was left to old man Brash on Q+A yesterday. Cunliffe made mincemeat of him. The Right still has no justification for flogging off profitable assets.

The video is here, and below is part of the transcript:

PAUL. H; The old bogey – asset sales – the sale of our state-owned enterprises.  It’s going to be one of the big issues probably of this election.  Prime Minister John Key says if National wins in November, they’ll put up for sale 49% of the shares in power companies Genesis, Meridian and Mighty River Power, coal miner Solid Energy and Air New Zealand.  This is proving to be a very difficult sell.  At the start of the year, the Prime Minister had this to say. “I think New Zealand’s ready for that grown-up debate about whether we can afford all the things that we’re doing and how we can best fund our future.

PAUL. H; Eight months on, sad to say, he’s not so keen to have that grown-up debate, because none of his people are coming on today.  We asked State-Owned Enterprises Minister Tony Ryall to front.  He said no to an interview and no to a debate with David Cunliffe, and he has a rule against debating David Cunliffe, it seems.  Finance Minister Bill English says National has spelled out its policy and he doesn’t see the need to debate the issue on asset sales, so the government is mum.  They are, however, happy to come on if or when they figure out how to ensure Kiwi investors get first dibs on those shares.  We’ve said, well, we’ll hold them to that.  Today instead we’re delighted to have Dr Don Brash with us, the ACT leader, and the supporter of the asset sales.  He joins us in Wellington.  And Labour’s David Cunliffe, who doesn’t think they’re a good idea at all, with Guyon.

DAVID. C; “Well, there certainly is the emotional power it in.  New Zealanders are very clear in what they think, and I can tell you that polling that lines asset sales up against our fair tax package says three to one, people prefer to keep their assets and pay down their debt, while some of Don Brash’s rich white old men who are enjoying their tax cuts are made to pay a capital gains tax, like they should’ve been as he said when he was the governor of the Reserve Bank.

DAVID.C; “Look, I really will insist on finishing this, because Don Brash is in no place to lecture the New Zealand public about populism.  I did not give the Orewa speech; somebody else did.  Now, Mr Brash knows very very well that New Zealanders care about long-term solutions.  They know that selling off the family silver to pay for six months’ worth of government deficit and losing on the—

DON.B;   That’s nonsense, David. You know it.

DAVID.C; “It’s not rhetoric.  I know that there is $300 million in dividends from those assets.  I know that the government will pay around $350 million to the ticket-clippers who will be involved in the sale, and I know that New Zealanders want to see a real game plan that will feed the kids in South Auckland and grow our economy without flogging off the birthright that we are handing down to the next generation”. So judge for yourself…tax the rich or sell the silver? The choice is yours…

In the begining all things were equal...yeah yeah.

Once we were innocent new born babes. We had needs that had to be met so as to survive. Some have suggested that all are born equal and that all consequently have an equal chance to make something of their lives…except of course… it’s a fairy tale.

The major factor in deciding ones destiny is who your parents are and in what kind of society they lived. If you were born in South Africa in the sixties and were black and poor your chances for success were almost zero. If you were born in the forties in New Orleans or London and you were black and poor your chances were also zero, but it was a slight improvement to being born black in South Africa.

The other key issue was if your parents were affluent or not, your chances of survival improved dramatically if your parents were financially independent, had good housing and access to educational and healthcare opportunities. Clearly the one thing we can’t control is who our parents are, that is a given.

After the great depression of the thirties New Zealand attempted to construct, but not always willingly, a society that gave the newly born no matter who, a possibility for a real future. It wasn’t entirely fair or just but it had those goals, some were still rich and others poor.

The then Government reinvented the first steps in ensuring that the gap between individuals was reduced. Those same farsighted leaders created State housing, universal medical care and free and compulsory [up to age 15] education, even university was free. They created infrastructure which we owned, like power, roads, banks etc. Our tax system was progressive and fair.

At that time we honoured our sportspeople not by paying them millions but by recognising their abilities and skills. Heroes weren’t those who ripped off others and got rich on the backs of others. We respected those who did well by honest means; back then, most were willing to pay taxes based on a truly progressive system:

So while you will be swamped by PR spin about the dangers of boat people arriving in their thousands, radical Maori taking over the country, or how buying your own assets will pay the bills [how silly is that], don’t be fooled just remember these simple three points: the tax system: employment: a fair wage structure. Today the wealth gap has grown wider and success is measured in money terms. We now know the cost of everything and the value of nothing. New Zealand has gone down in the equality stakes and according to world measurements the gap between rich and poor here has and is growing at a rapid rate.

 Maintaining social equality via: the tax system, employment and a fair wage structure are the stepping stones for a just and fair social system. Improving these is what this coming general election should be all about.

2.

One of the ways often suggested for managing the worlds’ resources is to control the worlds’ population. So as we run out of oil for example we reduce the population to reduce the demand for oil. The same would apply to food and every thing else. Before setting off down this path we need to answer some fundamental questions.

Who produces the most children? Answer the poor. Who controls and uses the most oil? Answer the rich. Conclusion: by preventing the poor from having children we don’t save oil. Action: make the poor rich so they have fewer children, but this would mean they would use more oil. Answer: find a replacement for oil. Outcome: many of those who have got rich by exploiting the oil shortage would become poor…and have more children. My conclusion: create the climate that creates less poor [redistributing wealth]: population problem partly solved. Seek to solve the peak oil problem by creating alternative energy sources.

To solve the food shortage, make the rich poorer so that they eat less [only joking] and so on. Population control by law [as in China] or population control by murder as practiced by the Nazi’s is surely not acceptable.  

3.

As for the Capital Gains Tax, here's a list of people who now all agree with Labour…at least to putting it on the agenda for serious consideration.
The Dominion Post, NBR, Herald on Sunday, Gisborne Herald, Waikato Times, The Greens, The IMF, The OECD, and columnists Paul Little, Mike Hosking, Gordon Campbell, Anthony Hubbard, Patrick Smellie, Vernon Small, Corin Dann, Andrea Vance, John Hartvell, Matthew Hooten, John Roughan, Duncan Garner, John Armstrong, Bernard Hickey, plus Gareth Morgan, Sam Morgan plus Academic tax experts, economists and TreasuryAnd here's the list of people who agree with John Key...John Key, Peter Dunne, ACT and the IRD.

Labour has now released their tax policy: a capital gains tax (with some exceptions, including the family home), a new top rate applying to those earning over $150,000 [39cents], no GST on fresh fruit and vegetables, and a $5,000 tax-free bracket.

Peter Dunne, who earns $209,100 as a Minister outside Cabinet, and who owns an investment property in Taupo, calls it a "desperate, ignorant attack on [his?] achievement". Dunne of course pays nothing if he simply hangs on to his property in Taupo.

This means that, 90% of New Zealanders will be better off. Over 98% of Kiwi’s will pay less personal income tax, and the vast majority of us will never encounter these new taxes at all.

The Labour Party has done the right thing in balancing the tax system. Sam Morgan was paid 700 million by Fairfax Ltd for Trade Me and never paid one cent in tax. Sam agreed that was wrong. The Labour plan is both prudent and necessary at this time. It is still very conservative but at least it closes the biggest loophole in our taxation system.

You now have a clear choice…sell off our assets and see the profits go off shore under National or make the wealthy pay their FAIR share. The choice is yours.